**Session Date/Time:** 10 Nov 2023 12:00

# pquip

## Summary
The pquip working group meeting covered several topics related to post-quantum cryptography (PQC) interoperability, terminology, and use cases. Presentations included updates on the PQNX 509 interoperability project, hybrid terminology, PQC for engineers, hybrid signature spectrums, PQC use cases, and a comparison of hybrid KEM drafts. Discussions focused on clarifying definitions, aligning algorithm choices across working groups, and the practical considerations of deploying PQC in different environments.

## Key Discussion Points
*   **PQNX 509 Interoperability Project:**
    *   Progress on testing PQC algorithms and creating an artifact format for interoperability testing.
    *   Collaboration with the NCCoE.
    *   The artifact pository format is a zip file containing trust anchors with self-signed certificates, and entities for Kyber as KEMs cannot be signed.
    *   Discussion on the OID mapping table.
*   **Hybrid Terminology:**
    *   Defining terminology for post-quantum traditional hybrid schemes.
    *   Discussion on the use of terms like "post-quantum" vs. "quantum-resistant."
    *   Debate on whether to publish as an RFC or maintain as a living document.
*   **PQC for Engineers:**
    *   Explaining the need for engineers to understand PQC and migration strategies.
    *   Addition of sections on authenticated key exchange and IKEv2.
    *   Discussion about hardware acceleration for PQC KEMs.
    *   Update on changes with Kyber becoming ML-KEM.
*   **Hybrid Signature Spectrums:**
    *   Exploring security properties of hybrid signature schemes, including separability and non-separability.
    *   Discussion on artifact, message and scheme level integration of signature schemes.
*   **PQC Use Cases:**
    *   Collecting and organizing use cases for PQC to aid in migration strategies.
    *   Considered a companion to the PQC for Engineers draft.
*   **Hybrid KEM Drafts Comparison:**
    *   Comparing different hybrid KEM drafts across various IETF working groups (CFG, TLS, LAMPS, OpenPGP, JOSE).
    *   Focus on algorithm choices, KDF constructions, and security considerations.
    *   Debate on which drafts fit which implementations.

## Decisions and Action Items
*   **Hybrid Terminology:**
    *   Add definitions for mixed certificate chains and multi-cert authentication in the next version.
    *   Address comments on the mailing list regarding the definition of traditional algorithms and multi-algorithm schemes.
*   **PQC for Engineers:**
    *   Add a paragraph comparing stateful hash-based signature sizes to SPHINCS+.
    *   Address open issues on the mailing list.
    *   Consider adding a section or subsection on hardware acceleration for PQC KEMs.
    *   Add note about the changes to Kyber and the cyber attack commitment.
*   **Hybrid Signature Spectrum:**
     *   Add language about black box implementation of underlying signature systems.
     *   Consider including a reference to pre-hashing.

## Next Steps
*   Continue working on the existing drafts and addressing open issues on the mailing lists.
*   Explore the possibility of a new virtual interim hackathon towards the end of January.
*   Discuss the alignment of algorithm choices and security considerations across different working groups.
*   Progress the Hybrid terminology document.
*   Pquip meeting monthly next meeting on Tuesday December 5.